My ongoing series about carrying in hospitals has been a bit of a disappointment to me. I am receiving a number of messages, comments, and emails warning me about raising a fuss with an employer about firearms. A couple of points:
Nurses in Florida are in extremely short supply. Good emergency nurses, even more so. To the point where hospitals are paying bonuses of $10,000 a year just to accept a job there, on top of their pay. Considering that nursing is an associate’s degree, a nurse fresh out of school who is starting with no experience is being offered $70,000 a year is pretty good money.
Unarmed security guards in Florida have to take a 40 hour class. They are easily replaced, and there is no hospital that is going to fire a nurse over their disagreement with the opinions of a security guard, barring unusual circumstances.
With that being said, I am not dumb enough to give the guard any of those unusual circumstances. I was polite and that is why it pissed off that guard. It went like this:
Security Guard: That law doesn’t apply here. You can’t carry a gun here because (reasons covered in other post)
DM: Really? I didn’t see that in the statute. Can you point me to that law, or cite the number? I would like to read it for myself.
SG: (produces Facebook page of local cops) See? The cops even say so. Just trust that security and the police know the law better than you do. It’s our job to worry about the law, you guys just need to worry about the medicine. If you see anyone that you think might have a gun, let us know and we will take care of it.
So like I said, Mall Ninja is practicing law by reading Facebook posts. So if THAT is the reason why I get fired, so what? Nursing shortage- I will have another job within a couple of days. Even so, that is why I have the emergency fund that I talked about last month. It’s called “fuck you” money. Don’t let someone use money to control you. You should be working on your financial independence.
To my second point, and the thing that really has me disappointed: If those of us in the freedom/gun community are too afraid to even ask questions of a security guard about gun policies at your place of employment, then how are we ever thinking that we will use those guns to defend your rights? If you won’t even risk pissing off a Mall Cop at your job, how will you ever use those same guns to defend freedom? If so, the entire argument about the Second Amendment is moot. You might as well turn them in for some gift cards. Think about how far you are willing to go in defending your rights.
I would also add that the nurses in the emergency room tend to be on the Conservative end of the spectrum. It’s hard to see what we see and still have a bleeding heart. I have already had in depth conversations about guns with several nurses and Doctors at the new job. Most of them belong to the local gun club, and there are even a couple of III% and Molon Labe stickers on vehicles in the parking lot. A couple of us are looking to setup a range day, and one nurse I was talking to is a precision rifle shooter who builds his own rifles and rolls his own ammo because factory isn’t precise enough. He was telling me about a 1,000 yard range that he makes the drive to. This is the most progun ED that I have ever worked in.
25 Comments
It's just Boris · July 3, 2023 at 9:32 am
Sounds like a good working environment. (No sarcasm intended.)
Re the rules and regs, I don’t ask the security guys at work; I went and read the company’s policy directly, as well as the local statutes. But then, I have pretty minimal interaction with the security guys beyond showing my employee badge at the entrance.
Divemedic · July 3, 2023 at 10:16 am
They have signs everywhere that say “This is a weapons free campus. No weapons are permitted on these premises.”
C · July 3, 2023 at 2:37 pm
Several of those signs at my campus. Funny thing. Only one of them is a valid legal sign. The state legislation lists the approved graphic and dimensions of the sign. It’s an odd size that you can’t print off a standard printer. Also supposed to be posted at every entrance. Including the loading dock and employee entrances. If they’re not at every entrance then the sign posted at a single entrance isn’t valid.
MN Steel · July 3, 2023 at 4:39 pm
Same thing in Somalifornia North.
ALL entrances need to be posted in the proper black letters on white background (many places have white stickers on the window/door glass), the worst that can happen is they ask you to leave, and if you come back armed you get a $50 fine.
I carry everywhere I go, at work I put it in a drawer so I don’t “have it on me” and since I do fieldwork in the woods I wouldn’t be caught unarmed with all the wolf shit everywhere while most others just say “I wish the would let us carry pistols”…
Danny · July 3, 2023 at 9:47 am
con•ceal | kənˈsēl |
verb [with object]
keep from sight; hide: a line of sand dunes concealed the distant sea.
• keep (something) secret; prevent from being known or noticed: love that they had to conceal from others.
DERIVATIVES
concealable | kənˈsēləb(ə)l | adjective
ORIGIN
Middle English: from Old French conceler, from Latin concelare, from con- ‘completely’ + celare ‘hide’.
I’m reminded of that phrase “don’t ask, don’t tell” — in that if I walk in to the establishment and nobody says “hey you – got a gun on ya?” then I go about my business.
Divemedic · July 3, 2023 at 10:18 am
They ask every patient if they have weapons on them when they check in. If there is a suspicion that you DO have a weapon, we are to call security, who will wand you to see if you do.
Michael · July 3, 2023 at 1:02 pm
Divemedic we both have enough time in this hospital world to KNOW that the C suit HR is generally the reason we are working short. HR power trips are often why excellent nurses move onward..
Lable me a coward if you like but I don’t argue with anti-gun idiots, waste of time and energy.
I don’t yell at deer when hunting, so why give idiots targeting data? I also don’t have bumper stickers for the same reason.
Divemedic · July 3, 2023 at 9:34 pm
Not calling anyone a coward. Where would the Civil rights movement had gone if Rosa Parks had simply sat in the back of the bus?
A right that is not exercised is one that is lost. If you won’t even TALK to others about your rights, how will you ever fight for them?
My rights are more important to me than a job. I can get another job, but rights are gone forever once they are lost.
Michael · July 4, 2023 at 5:24 am
“I will accept any rules that you feel necessary to your freedom. I am free, no matter what rules surround me. If I find them tolerable, I tolerate them; if I find them too obnoxious, I break them. I am free because I know that I alone am morally responsible for everything I do.”
― Robert A. Heinlein, The Moon Is a Harsh Mistress
Talking to a brick wall seems foolish friend. If you could point me to a successful conversion (sans 3200 FPS) of a rabid idiot, please point it out.
Rosa Parks didn’t TALK ABOUT HER RIGHTS, she just clamed them and took the expected punishment.
She wasn’t the first one to disobey the Jim Crow Laws, many more did it and suffered from the democrats’ punishments. You know the KKK was a Democrat organization?
And like that Arab dude the dumped gasoline on himself and set himself ablaze was the TRIGGER of the Arab Spring.
So is talking about something with idiots really exercising your rights?
Divemedic · July 4, 2023 at 9:20 am
An even more important question: Is being afraid to talk to people, demanding your rights, and letting others fight for them while reaping the benefits of playing both sides some sort of badge of honor?
When will you set yourself on fire? Before or after you cash your paycheck?
I think that your position is just another variation of those who demand that others stack up and fight while refusing to do so yourself. There are ways to express your thoughts without risk of being fired. Don’t make excuses, take a stand.
Michael · July 4, 2023 at 3:24 pm
My English skills seem to be poorly suited to communicate clearly to you.
You continue to wander far a wide from what I said.
Good luck in your further endeavors.
Divemedic · July 4, 2023 at 7:09 pm
Don’t let a disagreement in a friendly discussion push you away.
Michael · July 5, 2023 at 8:27 am
In the era of Honor your comments face to face would have our seconds checking the swords for equal length and heft.
It helps to re-read one’s own words before posting.
Maybe if the Rumit is correct the nuclear incident Zelensky’s been broadcasting will be near. We will see if the internet is down, eh?
Divemedic · July 6, 2023 at 7:26 am
I am careful here to attack ideas and not people. It is my hope that in doing so, we cause others to reexamine their beliefs and take a look at the stand they are taking. This is how we learn. The founding fathers faced the same sort of thing in their time, proving that there is nothing new under the sun. Their response is what I will share with you at this time:
“If ye love wealth better than liberty, the tranquility of servitude better than the animating contest of freedom, go home from us in peace. We ask not your counsels or arms. Crouch down and lick the hands which feed you. May your chains set lightly upon you, and may posterity forget that ye were our countrymen.”
― Samuel Adams
I have not been nearly as harsh as Mr Adams was.
Elrod · July 3, 2023 at 10:44 am
“This is a weapons free campus. No weapons are permitted on these premises.”
I’ve never been in an ER that didn’t have a dozen weapons within arm’s reach of everyone there.
Including the patients……..
EN2 SS · July 3, 2023 at 11:25 am
The last job I had, night shift foreman, the dayshift junior pussy foreman told the boss that I had a pistol and frequently carried it while working. The boss told the pussy “I know he does, I sold it to him to carry here, mind your own business.” This was before CCW was allowed, much less OC. Never had a problem. I was voted several times to be Most Likely to go Postal. LOL
Divemedic · July 3, 2023 at 12:03 pm
Once had a girlfriend who was the night shift dispatcher for a portable Xray company. She was the only one who worked over night in a sketchy neighborhood in Downtown Orlando. Since she was alone, there was no way she could harm a fellow employee or be assisted by another employee if attacked. The boss found out she had a firearm with her and told her to stop bringing it or she would be fired.
She got fired.
EN2 SS · July 3, 2023 at 1:19 pm
Good to hear about someone that will stand on their principles. Seems fewer and fewer are willing anymore.
Good Banana In Chiquitastan · July 3, 2023 at 2:15 pm
How long until a lawyer busts out Fakebook on his cellphone colostomy bag to point out muh law says this in court? (honk!)
Just wait until replacements get a uniform and Segway with a respect my authoritay powertrip.
Regarding doctor comrade fresh out of Marxist U, after waking up in some metal tube with whirring sounds under observation and loss of time during a life threatening medical disaster five years ago, a Pajeet says he’s faking while the young blonde MD in training said forcefully…no he’s not.
EN2 SS · July 3, 2023 at 7:06 pm
How long until a lawyer busts out Fakebook on his cellphone colostomy bag
You haven’t read about several “lawyers” that used the supposedly genius chat bots to write their briefs for court and the judges figured out that the cases quoted didn’t exist? Going by the libtard “judges”, I imagine a LOT of briefs and cases are settled on crap.
Noway2 · July 3, 2023 at 4:52 pm
In te: “ My ongoing series about carrying in hospitals has been a bit of a disappointment to me.”
For what it’s worth, I’ve enjoyed reading your analysis. I live in NC, not Fl, but the legal structure around CC is similar, it’s a partial carved out exception to a general prohibition for those with permits. Of course, the orcs are completely exempt. The introduction of permítelas carry certainly does introduce a number of potential intersections and unintended consequences where exact words do matter. A quagmire to be sure. Thank you for posting.
Jonathan · July 3, 2023 at 9:18 pm
I was having a discussion about this today with my boss – there are signs were I work quoting a federal regulation prohibiting weapons, but if you look at the text of the regulation it specifically exempts those authorized by state or federal governments to carry a weapon.
The regulation was promulgated before concealed carry permits existed or were required and the interpretation has never been updated to reflect modernity (it’s the reg applied to pretty much any federal building and some non federal buildings doing government related work).
It helps that I live in a very gun friendly county – my county courthouse is the only one I’ve EVER seen that has no security or access control; I’ve seen numerous ordinary people open carrying in it.
As mentioned elsewhere, if you carry well concealed and don’t talk about it, nobody will know. I carry a polymer frame 380 and sometimes even *I* forget I’m carrying!
Divemedic · July 3, 2023 at 9:35 pm
Security regularly wands people. They also want us to check our patients for weapons and report this to security if any are suspected. What would you do?
Robert · July 3, 2023 at 9:36 pm
I enjoy reading your postings. Good stories that make a lot of sense.
The offices in which I work seem to have a “don’t ask, don’t tell” policy. Works for me.
Stay safe. Best of luck to you.
BobF · July 3, 2023 at 10:53 pm
Don’t remember how we got into it, but a specialist doc and I got into a discussion about guns and I found out he’s a fellow 2A person. He was practicing in the building adjacent to a Florida Health (at that time) facility. I asked what he thought about the hospital prohibition law and the fact that such carry is not on the list of prohibited places. He was shocked. More so than just “news to me.” REALLY?! Yep, I’ll bring a copy in two weeks when we follow up.
Did so and he’d already checked it out. He said it was crazy ambiguous, but my take was that if it isn’t listed as not allowed, it is allowed. He didn’t come out and say it, but I’d bet anything he carries to work every day in that building. Well, used to. He moved away from (now) Advent Health.
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