All private gun sales will stop on 12/7/2023. On that day, the ATF’s new definition of “dealer” goes into effect. If you sell any firearm for more than you paid for it, you are now a gun dealer and must have an FFL. Considering the ATF’s habit of scanning and keeping 4473’s, this is nothing more than registration, and registration ALWAYS leads to confiscation.
Categories: tyranny
28 Comments
Jon · September 9, 2023 at 7:36 am
Lots or repetitive language twisting definitions to further restrict individual rights.
If they think it will do anything to prevent the hoodrats from hoodratting they’re fools; but heaven help Joe Avg if the ATF finds he sold his gats to Billy Bob for more than he paid even if he needed the $$$ to cover his monthly shortfall due to Biden Economy
Also, this section, (3)(B)(i) below, suggests that gun buybacks may no longer be viable if the firearms were stolen…..
(3) repetitively purchases for the purpose of resale, or sells or offers for sale firearms
(A) through straw or sham businesses,[65]
or individual straw purchasers or sellers; [66]
(B) that cannot lawfully be purchased or possessed, including:
(i) stolen firearms (18 U.S.C. 922(j)); [67
joe · September 9, 2023 at 8:52 am
this has nothing to do with hood rats having guns and everything to do with restricting the 2A and law abiding citizens… nazis will nazi…
Lenny Ladner · September 9, 2023 at 9:08 am
All of these agencies write their own rules, regulations, codes, guidelines and standards. They have the “Force” of law once they are published in the Federal Register. That is if no member of the House of Representatives complains.
Now these new rules, regulations, codes, guidelines and standards must get NEW FUNDING from the House of Representatives.
Now where are the so called “Conservative Republicans” on stopping this?.
Oh, is anybody buying tickets to see the Duke woman’s volleyball team?
neomunitor · September 9, 2023 at 9:15 am
I read the entire proposed rule. It is a sham. You don’t have to make a sale, much less make a profit. You can sell at a loss, give a gun away, or even just make a *purchase* and not a single sale, and they can charge you with engaging in the business of dealing in firearms. They plainly spell out your recourse is to go through administrative process to dismiss the charge or legal defense, showing the process is the punishment.
They describe that having more than one firearm of the same make, model and caliber means that you don’t have a collection but are dealing. That if you have any guns still new-in-box, you are dealing. But wait, there’s more! Because they now include a special terrorism clause, which has an equally nebulous definition, if they charge that you were dealing for the purpose of supporting terrorism (anything they want that to mean, e.g., J6) then your rights go out the window, your defense is severely limited, your chance at bail goes to zero, and you end up in a gulag.
This is absolutely an open ended, unclear regulation, entirely at the whim of the ATF to decide how and when to charge you and then use the system to break you.
EN2 SS · September 9, 2023 at 10:04 am
It’s coming? It’s been coming for decades, it is HERE NOW.
There is no voting/peaceful way back from the fascists abyss.
SiG · September 9, 2023 at 10:12 am
Sorry, Jon, but if you think this will negatively impact buybacks or any other activity by the anti-gun folks, you’re mistaken. Likewise if some Antifa a-hole sells a gun to another one.
It’s just more evidence of the dual system of justice.
Rick · September 9, 2023 at 10:38 am
There will be a certain amount of gun sellers prosecuted as examples. Some individuals will decide to not participate in commerce.
Other than that, very little will change. I see an increase in trade in the form of private persons agreeing to swap this for that.
Fedgov will have to work hard to establish this pistol is less valued than that pistol + ammo. Even then, it would be a tenuous prosecution.
It’ll be interesting how this affects builders. The receiver being the gun, adding additional parts to make it functional becomes ‘profit’ according to the ATF.
Anonymous · September 9, 2023 at 11:49 am
What’s the estimate of the maximum number of innocent-of-evil persons they could ruin with this before the rest stop it from being enforced? 10,000?
Divemedic · September 9, 2023 at 12:06 pm
This is going to be used as the pretext for rounding up anyone whom they declare to be an enemy of the state. Show trials.
Anonymous · September 9, 2023 at 1:36 pm
Rounding up and show trials, sure. But that’s not a phrase that’s supposed to make me scream, then send a donation to a nonprofit political party. Instead it could be an actual physical thing, as happened in China, Russia, and Germany in the 20th century. So, how many people will get rounded up/show trialed/etc. before the remainder stop complying with the demands to meekly do the equivalent of getting into the boxcars? In the USA I suppose it would be get into white prison buses with expanded metal on the windows.
In 2014 Connecticut send out 250,000 registered letters to suspected gun owners warning to comply with a new gun registration law, and in response they had 10% compliance and zero percent roundups. Maybe this is the national attempt at same, and in response nobody will ever report a non-retail-store transfer again.
Divemedic · September 9, 2023 at 1:44 pm
Ask all of the J6 protesters who are being sentenced to what is effectively a life sentence whether or not the left is willing to round people up.
Anonymous · September 9, 2023 at 1:44 pm
You may recall back in the 1990’s when OSHA declared it was going to regulate and inspect home offices. The public laughed about that for a week, then it disappeared from the news never to be seen again.
Divemedic · September 9, 2023 at 1:47 pm
Joe Biggs of Daytona: 33 years
Enrique Tarrio, of Miami 33 years
Zachary Rehl 30 years
Ethan Nordean 27 years
Dominic Pezzola, 20 years
Elmer Stewart Rhodes, 18 years
For walking through the capitol (in one case, not even being in DC when it happened) after being let in by the cops.
Aesop · September 9, 2023 at 1:23 pm
I disagree.
I think rather that private party sales will become completely private.
No paper. No rules. No records. A handshake, and an exchange of cash for weaponry.
No NICS checks.
No more give-a-damn.
“To be an outlaw, you must be honest.” – Bob Dylan
If you’re going to hang everyone for thieves, expect bank robbery to become a growth industry.
And as Oleg Volk noted, if it’s going to be a felony to buy a gun privately, you might as well buy a home-made full auto submachinegun with a silencer. They can only hang you once.
And ATF agents are going to move into the shoot-on-sight category in a lot of places.
Ask the Waco office how it works for morale when the range goes hot in both directions.
When you make half the country terrorists overnight, expect them to take you up on the offer.
With interest, and commendable zeal.
This is not going to work out for TPTB.
Even odds it’s mooted in court within a year, if not within this year.
“Make the enemy live up to its own book of rules.” – Saul Alinsky
Anonymous · September 9, 2023 at 2:45 pm
Loose lips sink ships. Suppose you’ve snuck your new contraband object into your gun safe at home, and your family didn’t see you. Will your safe queen ever come out again? What if your wife/girlfriend/children/neighbor/Fuuds at the range see it, will they gossip to someone, who tells two friends, and they tell two friends, eventually reaching someone who will drop a dime on you? What will do you, when all the people you’ve made a family with are government enforcers? How many men burned in the camps because they wouldn’t stand up to their wives? I see this as evolution in action, both for the women whose husband is the government, and the men who submit to anyone who demands it.
J6 participants were willing to hold still and be rounded up. That was their second mistake, after their first mistake of participating in J6.
Divemedic · September 9, 2023 at 3:55 pm
Who knows what guns you own or don’t own? My wife doesn’t. The guys at the range certainly don’t. I’ve got two large safes and some smaller lock boxes. No one knows exactly what is in them, and that includes me. I can’t even tell you the exact contents of those safes off of the top of my head. I have an inventory of my “on paper” guns, and I could refer to that, but my off paper and 80percent builds? I don’t keep a record of those.
Moving around and becoming a fugitive is essentially ending your own life, and that isn’t even taking the fact that you WILL eventually be caught or killed while waging your little one man war into account. People won’t do that lightly.
Bear Claw · September 10, 2023 at 7:18 pm
“The most terrifying force of death comes from the hands of Men who wanted to be left Alone. They try, so very hard, to mind their own business and provide for themselves and those they love. They resist every impulse to fight back, knowing the forced and permanent change of life that will come from it. They know that the moment they fight back, their lives as they have lived them, are over. The moment the Men who wanted to be left alone are forced to fight back, it is a form of suicide. They are literally killing off who they used to be. Which is why, when forced to take up violence, these Men who wanted to be left alone, fight with unholy vengeance against those who murdered their former lives. They fight with raw hate, and a drive that cannot be fathomed by those who are merely play-acting at politics and terror. TRUE TERROR will arrive at these people’s door, and they will cry, scream, and beg for mercy… but it will fall upon the deaf ears of the Men who just wanted to be left alone.”
Anonymous · September 9, 2023 at 6:09 pm
Moving around and becoming a fugitive is essentially ending your own life, and that isn’t even taking the fact that you WILL eventually be caught or killed while waging your little one man war into account. People won’t do that lightly.
I agree, but, people having this exact mindset are still willing to drop dimes for, and vote for, the CFR-approved candidates. It’s going to get worse before it gets better.
Anonymous · September 9, 2023 at 3:12 pm
Hahahahahahahahahahahaha…
Yeah, ok.
EABOD boi’s.
I remember the Real, gas reciept days.
Olguy · September 9, 2023 at 3:16 pm
Hahahaha…
I remember the hand written gas reciept days if one wants to go that route.
Or as stated…
…”sales will become completely private.
No paper. No rules. No records. A handshake, and an exchange of cash for weaponry.
No NICS checks.
No more give-a-damn.”
Either works.
Divemedic · September 9, 2023 at 3:58 pm
I don’t remember handwritten gas receipts. What are you referring to, and how would that apply to guns?
Unknownsailor · September 9, 2023 at 3:24 pm
Imagine thinking I still need to go to a dealer to buy a firearm receiver.
3d printer goes brrrrrr. Decktop CNC machine goes wrrrrrrrr.
The days of government being able to restrict access to firearms is over, they just don’t know it yet.
Ammunition is still the weak point, however.
Divemedic · September 9, 2023 at 4:03 pm
I am considering a 3D printer for that exact reason. However, don’t expect F troop to be blind to that. The sale of firearms parts is going to end at some point.
Unknownsailor · September 9, 2023 at 11:11 pm
That is what the desktop CNC machine is for.
There are also ways to design around that with 3d printing, too. The FGC-9 design has plans for making the barrel yourself out of metal pipe using EDM, which is electrolysis “machining” using a mandrel you 3d print. Takes a while, but it works.
Anonymous · September 9, 2023 at 3:42 pm
I see dead F Troop members.
Anon · September 9, 2023 at 8:16 pm
https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=LH8gUhDd6WE&pp=ygUVYm9keSBjb3VudCBjb3Aga2lsbGVy
realwesterner · September 10, 2023 at 4:37 pm
More perverted communist machinations. When running fast becomes a problem, shoelaces will be deemed contraband, and no more “4wd” when you’re wearing your crocs…as if. Aesop covers a lot of solid ground. The persecution of the J6’ers, the persecution of 45, the cancelling of oil and gas leases, the homo/trashsexual agenda, the gaslighting and lies are all to incite The Right into violent action so that TPTB can unleash most brutal, ghastly, deadly and outrageous retaliations. Like a drunken abuser, they long lustily and greedily for the moment their victim rises up so then to justify the full weight of their might and wrath. The khriminal khartel are obviously behind “fake meh-hi-can” Grisham and the ATF and the EPA, and the FBI, and the DOJ, and the lying media and the courts…and the edjucashionill sistim…and, and, and…
Aesop on ATF’s Latest Commie Horse Shit “Rule” · September 10, 2023 at 3:01 pm
[…] H/T Area Ocho […]
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