News6 in Orlando has their panties in a twist over 17 people statewide who died after being sedated in Florida over the past decade. Every time I try to comment on an article on this website, it gets censored for violating community standards, because lefties have to be protected from facts.
You have a violent psychotic person that is a danger to themselves and everyone around them. Now explain how you get that violent person under control. There are only a few ways to stop someone who is out of their minds in a violent rampage:
- You can shoot them.
- You can sedate them.
- You can beat them into submission.
Which of those is the least likely to cause lasting harm? The ones who died are being killed because they are using some sort of illegal drug, whose effects can’t be predicted because criminal drug dealers can’t be bothered with things like quality control. The drug user, who already likely has mental issues BEFORE becoming an addict, then becomes violent, delusional, and psychotic.
So an EMS crew administers a sedative. Those sedatives are safe and effective, and get used thousands of times every day in the state of Florida without incident. (Just yesterday, I gave Versed to a 5 year old. She did fine, and all that happened to her was she took a nap) The problem here is that the sedative interacts with the unknown substances that the violent drug abuser is using, and the results are unpredictable, and sadly, sometimes fatal.
Of course they are given without consent. A person who is out of their minds while under the influence of drugs can’t legally give consent, any more than a person in cardiac arrest can. That statement is enough for me to realize that this entire article is clickbait.
Just yesterday, I gave Narcan, Fentanyl, Versed, Morphine, and Dilaudid to patients- some of them without consent. They all lived, because most of them weren’t drug fueled psychotics.
14 Comments
jimmyPx · April 26, 2024 at 11:07 am
I’ll bet $1 that more than 17 people died in Florida in the past decade because of being stung by bees — so what ?
There is NO common sense anymore and any of these bleeding hearts writing this crap need to spend an evening in the ER and they will stop spouting this nonsense.
I’ve been saying it for years but one thing that our country DESPERATELY needs is long term care facilities for the mentally ill. They simply do NOT exist and while it would be expensive, if we had these facilities alot of the homeless and alot of the prison population would be getting the care they need and not hurting other people.
Instead, the poor people in the ERs have to deal with the severely mentally ill who also often have severe drug addictions because they are self medicating. What are the ER docs and nurses supposed to do when someone is brought in and is out of control and can’t be reasoned with ?
A little shot and it’s all better for everyone.
Mike · April 26, 2024 at 8:02 pm
I would say 17 people in 10 years is an awfully low number. Just out of curiosity, what is Fentanyl legally used for?
Divemedic · April 27, 2024 at 12:14 am
It’s a rather good painkiller. It’s routinely given in the ED for severe pain, especially when patients can’t receive other ones for one reason or another. Our typical dose is 50-200 micrograms.
jimmyPx · April 27, 2024 at 10:14 am
Fentanyl is also heavily used in hospices especially for terminal cancer patients who would be in agony without heavy pain meds.
Dan D. · April 27, 2024 at 2:15 pm
Comes in literal lollipop form for field medics. They tape the stick to your hand so if you disassociate (pass out) your arm drops and pulls it out of your mouth. Very useful drug.
Divemedic · April 27, 2024 at 2:52 pm
I haven’t heard of civilian field medics being given those. The Fentanyl lollipops are used only by the military, AFAIK.
C · April 27, 2024 at 8:53 am
If it were up to me, we’d have public caning in all 50 states. Unfortunately I’m in the minority with this opinion.
Aesop · April 27, 2024 at 10:23 am
Oh, please.
If there were sedation meds that could predictably sedate violent psychotics all the way to room temperature, I’d be carrying them across my chest on double bandoliers.
If I found out there were EMS crews who had taken out 17 violent psychotics, accidentally or any other way, I’d happily blow an entire paycheck taking those crews out for a steak and lobster feast on my nickel as a ‘Thank You’ gesture.
In a perfect world, we’d use succinylcholine on most of them (those of you not in the biz should Google that one), and skip the ET tube. Runner-up would be a 5-year ban on Narcan, and let Darwin cull the herd.
BTW, the other reason for Fentanyl (actual pharmaceutical-grade fentanyl, not garage-brew carfentanil, which latter drug cartel export is about 98% of the “opiate” problem in this country) use is because great acute pain control, and the half-life is so short, you can’t become addicted to it. It kicks in in minutes, but it’s out of your system in a few hours.
And most people are completely unaware that the average ED gives out all the drugs used for judicial lethal injections, every single day. We just do them in therapeutic doses, and not all three stacked back-to-back. Mostly. đ
Dan D. · April 27, 2024 at 2:22 pm
â5-year ban on Narcan, and let Darwin cull the herd.â
My buddy Justin from our county sherrifâs office opened a bag after a traffic stop and it was full of fentanyl. Apparently he got a whiff and awoke in the ED. Took two Naloxone hits to keep him breathing, courtesy of other officers on the scene.
Careful with that broad brush, fan-o-Darwin.
Divemedic · April 27, 2024 at 2:51 pm
Those stories are largely bullshit. Simply opening the bag isn’t enough to cause that. This is hysteria that didn’t happen until the let cops begin carrying around Narcan after a 2 hour class on how to give it, even though cops know fuck-all about drugs and their effects on people. Ever since they began giving Narcan to the cops to carry around, they give it all the time to almost everyone, even people who donât need it.
The cops got a short lecture on naloxone, less than 2 hours of training in some cases, then were turned loose. Now there are tons of companies making money selling âFentanyl proofâ gloves, and the legend grows with every viral, unsupported video. I posted about this a year and a half ago. In fact, there has never been a case of LEO opioid overdose that has been confirmed by toxicology.
Sorry, cops don’t know shit about drugs. If Fentanyl were so dangerous that even opening a bag containing it is enough to kill you, then how did the drug dealers themselves survive putting the drugs in the bag in the first place?
From the American College of Medical Toxicology (ACMT) and American Academy of Clinical Toxicology(AACT): âthe risk of clinically significant exposure to emergency responders is extremely low. To date, we have not seen reports of emergency responders developing signs or symptoms consistent with opioid toxicity from incidental contact with opioids…Industrial producers of fentanyl use time-weighted average occupational exposure limits (OEL-TWA) for alfentanil (1mcg/m3), fentanyl (0.1 mcg/m3), and sufentanil (0.032 mcg/m3) to limit exposure. At the highest airborne concentration encountered by workers, an unprotected individual would require nearly 200 minutes of exposure to reach a dose of 100 mcg of Fentanyl. The vapor pressure of fentanyl is very low (4.6 x 10-6Pa) suggesting that evaporation of standing product into a gaseous phase is not a practical concernâ
Nearly every day, we get the cops bringing in someone who they claim was revived after several doses of Narcan. We do a toxicology screen, and there are no opiate metabolites in the person’s blood. Oops, the cops are wrong again.
Dan D. · April 27, 2024 at 4:54 pm
Copy, sir. Let me verify directly with my friend and training partner that he didnât âaugmentâ his recollection of the incident. He did say his event created a change in dept. policy so that should be able to be referenced.
As to the lollis above, yes mil field medics. Anyone can Google photos of the color coded strengths but the only pics Iâve seen them in use in theatre are in the JSOM.
Divemedic · April 27, 2024 at 8:05 pm
He may not even know that he is wrong. Again, cops don’t know anything about drugs, so as soon as someone acts funny around what they think is Fentanyl, they begin hitting them with Narcan. When the person doesn’t die, they pat themselves on the back for making “another save” and go back to telling everyone that they are heroes that are out there risking their lives to save yours.
Aesop · April 27, 2024 at 8:18 pm
That wasn’t a bag of “fentanyl”, to a 99 44/100ths percent certainty.
Fentanyl is harder to get than SAC’s nuclear missile launch codes.
QED
Carfentanil, maybe. Which ain’t even clkosew to the same thing. But it would have had to have been the pure stuff, not cut, which would have killed twenty other people as noted by our host.
And as noted above, the guy probably vaso-vagaled. IOW “fainted”.
But I’m open to forensic evidence (as opposed to “war stories”) to the contrary.
If we stopped giving Narcan away to street junkies, and restricted admin to ER use only, we could get rid of the junkie population by their own hands – and choices – in about 6 months. That’s called freedom, baby.
Make drug abuse great again: ban Narcan.
49%mfer · April 27, 2024 at 7:57 pm
I’m kind of partial to option #3, but you do you.
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